What is mold illness?

Mold illness, also called Chronic Inflammatory Response Syndrome (CIRS), is a multi-system, multi-symptom illness triggered by exposure to biotoxins produced by mold in water-damaged buildings. It affects the immune, neurological, hormonal, and gastrointestinal systems and is frequently misdiagnosed as fibromyalgia, lupus, multiple sclerosis, or chronic fatigue syndrome.

What are the symptoms of mold illness?

Mold illness symptoms span multiple body systems and include fatigue, brain fog, memory problems, headaches, joint pain, muscle aches, shortness of breath, chronic sinus issues, sensitivity to light, mood changes, anxiety, depression, digestive problems, and sleep disturbances. Symptoms often worsen in water-damaged environments and improve temporarily when away from them.

Why do most doctors miss mold illness?

Most conventional physicians are not trained in Environmental Medicine and are unfamiliar with mycotoxin testing or CIRS diagnostic criteria. Symptoms overlap with many other conditions, and standard lab panels often miss mold illness entirely. Specialized testing including urine mycotoxin panels, inflammatory marker panels, and HLA-DR genetic testing are required for accurate diagnosis.

How is mold illness diagnosed?

Mold illness is diagnosed through a combination of a detailed patient history, environmental exposure assessment, and specialized laboratory testing including urine mycotoxin testing, inflammatory markers (TGF-beta, MMP-9, C4a), HLA-DR genetic susceptibility testing, and visual contrast sensitivity testing. At Deeper Healing, diagnosis begins with a comprehensive intake questionnaire and is confirmed through targeted lab panels.

How is mold illness treated?

Effective mold illness treatment requires first removing the patient from the source of exposure, then systematically reducing mycotoxin burden in the body using binders, detoxification protocols, IV nutritional therapy, cellular cleanse therapies, and immune system support. At Deeper Healing, treatment follows a sequenced protocol that addresses each phase of recovery — elimination, detoxification, and rebuilding — in the correct order.

Do I have to live in Charleston to become a patient at Deeper Healing?

No. Deeper Healing serves patients from across the United States. Many travel to Charleston for the Stay + Heal program, an immersive multi-day treatment experience designed specifically for patients who cannot access this level of care locally. Mycotoxin home test kits can also be shipped to your location before your first visit.

What is mycotoxin testing and do I need it?

Mycotoxin testing is a urine-based laboratory test that measures the presence and levels of specific fungal toxins in your body. It is one of the most direct ways to confirm biotoxin exposure. Deeper Healing offers both in-office and mail-in home testing kits. If you have unexplained chronic symptoms — especially fatigue, brain fog, or immune dysfunction — mycotoxin testing is an important diagnostic step.

Does insurance cover mold illness treatment at Deeper Healing?

Deeper Healing is a self-pay practice. Most environmental and functional medicine services are not covered by conventional health insurance. However, financing options are available to make treatment accessible. Patients frequently find that the investment in root-cause treatment reduces or eliminates the ongoing costs of managing symptoms through conventional care.

Can mold illness cause autoimmune disease?

Yes. Prolonged mycotoxin exposure and the chronic inflammatory response it triggers can activate or worsen autoimmune conditions. Mold illness is frequently misdiagnosed as lupus, rheumatoid arthritis, multiple sclerosis, and sarcoidosis. At Deeper Healing, we assess environmental toxin exposure as a root cause in all autoimmune presentations.

How long does it take to recover from mold illness?

Recovery from mold illness varies significantly depending on duration of exposure, mycotoxin burden, genetic susceptibility, and whether the patient has been removed from the source. Some patients experience significant improvement within weeks of beginning a targeted protocol. Others with longer-standing illness and higher toxin loads require months of treatment. At Deeper Healing, patients typically report meaningful progress during and shortly after their initial treatment period.

Watch on DrTalks

From Burnout to Breakthrough: How Chip got back to living

Chronic symptoms like fatigue, brain fog, and digestive pain aren’t something you have to just live with — they’re signals that something deeper is wrong, and finding the root cause changes everything.
Conventional medicine often treats the surface. When Chip was finally tested for the right things — heavy metal toxicity, inflammation, gut dysfunction — the real picture emerged and a real solution became possible.
Recovery doesn’t have to take years. With the right protocol targeting the true root cause, Chip experienced dramatic transformation in a matter of weeks — and got back not just his health, but his relationships, his energy, and his joy.

About the Expert

Danielle Howley

Patient Advocate and Founder of Deeper Healing

Danielle Howley co-founded Deeper Healing by literally stalking Dr. Bauerschmidt. She was on a mission – determined to create an innovative, compassionate healing center she desperately searched for but could never find during the ten years her husband was chronically ill and bedridden (healed for years now and the inspiration behind Deeper Healing). Danielle holds a Bachelor of Science from Drexel University with a Minor in Psychology and attended graduate school at the University of Pennsylvania, where she focused on Education, Culture and Society. She's spent her entire career at the intersection of marketing and health/wellness. For twenty years, she ran a marketing consulting firm building campaigns for major clients including Aetna U.S. Healthcare, University of Pennsylvania Medical School, Novartis, Chester County Hospital, and Vanguard. Her personal journey into environmental medicine began when her firstborn arrived prematurely, pushing her to create a safe, non-toxic home environment. That commitment intensified when her husband became mysteriously, severely ill. Eventually, she combined her professional expertise with her hard-won personal experience to help others heal naturally through Deeper Healing—a dream come true.Through the years, Danielle became intimately connected to so many patient recovery stories that she wanted to create a platform for them to share their healing journeys in their own words. That vision became The Deeper Healing Podcast.

Guest

Chip Lake

Chip Lake is a business owner and farmer — a regular guy who spent years suffering through symptoms that conventional medicine brushed off and couldn't fix. Fatigue, brain fog, and digestive pain so severe it turned every meal into an ordeal slowly stole the joy from his everyday life. When he finally came to Deeper Healing and got the right answers, his recovery was swift and dramatic. Chip shares his story not because he's a medical expert — but because he knows how many guys are out there waiting too long, just like he did.

More from Chip Lake on DrTalks

I've never thought about not wanting to exist, not going through life. You know, that's not the way you're supposed to live. It got to a point where it was so bad.

that I didn't wanna get up in the morning, that's not me. When you get to someone like Deeper Healing and they sit down and, they're not trying to sell you something, you're trying not to be forced into something.

That's why I said it's between your ears because this isn't a microwave mentality to go, oh, we're gonna give you a couple pills, come back in three weeks and let's just see where you are.

No, it was go in, let build a baseline, Let's find out what's wrong. And that's the wrong way to say it. It's not what's wrong. Let's just find out the problematic areas and let's go nail it and reverse it, not rocket science, it's simple things.

Welcome to the Deeper Healing Podcast. I'm your host, Danielle Howley. This is for everyone who's been dismissed, misdiagnosed or told to just live with it – and refuse to accept that answer.

You're going to hear amazing patient recovery stories, raw and real in their own words. People who found answers after everything had failed them. You are going hear from medical experts we trust that are pioneering new approaches to healing the body.

Because we deeply know we're designed to heal. Let's dig in. Hi everybody, we're here today with a really special guy, this is Chip Lake. Chip's a dad, he's business owner, has an amazing kitchen cabinet design company.

He also has and incredible farm, 40 acre farm in McClellanville that is a little slice of heaven. And on that farm, he's got all kinds of stuff growing and pigs and chickens and all kind of dogs and they've got it all he got.

He's Got it. All he has got farm equipment, all the things. So this is a guy who's gotta lot on his plate. You're a busy person. you got your you gotta busy thing going on at home.

We got a business thing gone on with your job. and started having some problems with your health. So why don't you take us back to where you were? Well, I think being the age that I am and you start looking around you, what made me aware was that as I was having headaches, as having a tough time getting out of bed in the morning, that was restless, couldn't go to sleep properly, it was just everything.

My wife was saying I was snoring with my mouth open like she was to the point She didn't want to stay in the same room with me when we when it got dark because it's just about irritability Went through the roof.

I I've I Was struggling Keeping myself straight like thought patterns, like I'd be going down the road and then all of a sudden it just cut off. And that's hard to explain because you don't realize what's happening to you because it's so gradual over a course of time.

But it had gotten to the point that the doctor I was going to started telling me, oh, you've got high blood pressure. That's the cause of the headaches and this issue you're having, your fatigue.

And so he did put me on some blood-pressure medicine. It took the tightening of band around my head effect away, but I really didn't feel better. I'm like, shouldn't I feel better?

If that's the problem is the hypertension, then if we've corrected that to the level that we tried to, what's wrong? This doctor had prescribed statins to me without telling me.

I showed up at the pharmacy and the pharmacist was explaining what I was getting ready to take. And when the word statin came out, I blanked out. This is not for me, those are bad, in my opinion.

In my world, these are drugs. or acetaminophen or anything like that. I like to do the right thing. And that's when I said, not today. That's what I called you, Danielle.

This is it. Deeper healing it is. So, you know, filled out my questionnaire. It's very informative, made me really think about. Some things took me a little bit to fill it out because it's reality slapping you in the face real quick.

And being a man, we don't like to have faults. We don' like know we're sick. You know, strong creatures, and we can handle anything. Were you pushed into going in?

No, meaning like, was your wife with someone because that because I'll see that a lot. I was pushed in by just not wanting where you were. Not I. Was done.

Yeah. suffer in a quality of life for the rest of your life, like how do you explain that to your wife and children? Like this is just me. It's affecting my work, it's effecting my freedom, its effectting my marriage.

And to go in and have these tests done, not knowing what to expect, and to have someone like… It is tough, you know? They have Jules sit there, but deeper healing and just tell me how I felt in words.

It was amazing. You're going back to the suffering that you were in. Right. I can see you like I'm actually going there in my mind of how bad it was. Because I was done.

If they can't fix it, where do I go? Like am I, you know, I hate to say it but like, God, would I be better off just dead? You know then the pain would go away.

What kind of pain were you having? Just walking, just getting out of the bed and you, know I was at that point that I You know, reaching for, wow, I'm 56 years old.

I shouldn't experience this. Gaining weight and don't know why. Everything bothers me. Like I am not happy with anything. And so to be able to try to explain what Jules told me that day when I was sitting there, she's like, okay, let's look at your labs.

Let's see what's there. And she was like oh, you should be feeling like this because of this. Wow, your tests are, there's some serious things here. Yeah, do you mind talking about something else?

I want to bring the audience back up to speak because you skipped a couple steps really quick. You went from, I filled out some questionnaire and it was very affronting because it's asking you questions that you're like, wait a minute.

Right. And I do find the deeper healing questionnaire people are never asked those questions by a physician. No, you're not faced with that kind of reality.

Yeah, so it's a little like, oh, wow, I didn't know that could have affected me, and so there's lot of awakenings just filling out the paperwork. But be realistic.

And also realistic about it. I always say to people like fill it out thoughtfully, don't beat yourself up, we need to know what's going on. And then, so now you're in, you chose to see the nurse practitioner.

Her name is Julianne Ingham. She's awesome. And you are in your 60-minute consult with her. There was one other very important pain point because I remember I did your onboarding.

And your daughter had also said it to me too. You were choking choking I couldn't hardly eat every time you were eating and at that time You are like if I can just eat Enjoy I'm not even able to enjoy a meal.

So here you're not sleeping. I literally not eating No wonder you are in a negative mindset in addition to everything else Okay, so I just wanted to bring that back around so we had the full picture of like, you're really suffering.

It was bad. Let's put it like it was. Yeah. What do I do? I'm on that seesaw of I've never thought about not wanting to exist, not going through life.

You know, that's not the way you're supposed to live. So the biggest part of all of this was between my ears, like the mental part, I'm the he-man, you know.

I've got a family to take care of, children to look up to me, a sphere around me that expects me to go to a certain level every day to get the job done.

And it kills me every day. Some days I'd go home and just lie down and I didn't want to get up. And of course, I was hungry, but I did want eat because I don't wanna choke.

You're like, oh, wow, gotta take a shower and oh I gotta do the laundry or I've got to do this. It's just you see that constant decline and all of a sudden it got a point where it was so bad.

that I didn't want to get up in the morning. That's not me. I don't miss a day. And I have to pause because knowing you, you're a very positive extroverted person, personality.

Yeah. Also, I think what you just expressed in The Last Minute is a ton of guys out there. All guys. A ton especially at this age, this middle age where they're feeling the pressure of, you know, the kids and the college and work and family and a farm.

You have a big responsibility in your personal life that a lot of people don't have. Your weekends are not laying around on the sofa. Right. Yeah. So, for you to feel like You're you were definitely trapped in a corner because you're like I have my responsibilities are massive And my and how do I get out of it?

How do i just feel better? I mean just for a little bit like, you know The the sad thing is is like when you go to work and you are in physical pipe nature remodeling building Cabinetry all this stuff.

I means you you it's physical work. So you feel like oh i'm a man today. And I got to move. And then when you stop, it takes you a little bit to get into the rhythm, and then you've stretched out a bit.

It's like you get in to it, you gotta do it. Then when it stops, like some days, just the pain from wherever the job site was, back to my house, I would sit in my truck and go, wow, I got to move again.

And I'd get out of it and just be so stiff and so swollen feeling and cramped up feeling like I'm like, something is wrong. This is not blood pressure.

What is Wrong with these people? Because it's not the only one doctor I saw. It's just like the multitude of people that I talked to is like oh, it was just blood, pressure, hypertension causes all that.

Then when you get to someone like deeper healing and they sit down and They're not trying to sell you something. You're, not to be forced into something that's why I said it's between your ears because this isn't a Microwave mentality to go.

Oh, we're going to give you a couple pills Come back in three weeks and let's just see where you are. No, it was go in. Let's build a baseline Let us find out what's wrong And not even that that is the wrong way to say it.

It's not what wrong. let us just find the problematic areas and Let go nail it And let's go reverse it. And it's not rocket science. It's just simple things.

The one thing Jules couldn't, that we were sitting there talking, she's like, I'm like yeah, already do some of that. Like the world I was living in, trying to explore things on my own, like the vitamin C stuff and the, The glutathione and just little things, I was doing things in the right step.

I just wasn't doing it to the level. Yeah, you need therapeutic doses. You do. And knowing that the natural way I wanted to take that approach to finding the way to heal what I thought might be wrong or to increase stuff to feel better.

I was just skimming the surface, but at least I wasn't informed. Yeah. Right. I had, I, was mentally there already to try this because I knew it wasn' t go, gonna be go pick up the prescription.

Let's go take this and, you know, come back in a month and let's see where you are. It was like, no, here's where your at. This is what we have to attack and this is how we're going to do it.

Here's what, we recommend you pick. We're kind of just the way it was. I'm like, I am all in. All 10 toes, all 10 fingers, i'm ready to go. When do we start?

So, so proud of you. And I m so grateful that you're willing to share because I know this has going have an impact on a lot of people. I think the one thing that you just hit on is everybody, everybody deserves that deep dive.

Like even if it's just one time in your life, where it was like, what's really going on under my hood? You know, like so that's basically what you did with Julianne.

You did the environmental testing. So you checked your mic, your mold, you check your metals and you get a very deep blood panel like you've never had before.

And I call it the big reveal day where you're sitting down with your practitioner and we're like, okay, let's see what's going on with you. So now we have your whole history and all your labs and it's really time to figure out what is going.

Great. Let's talk about that. That was freedom. I mean, I broke down. I mean, it's still, I'm just really emotional about it because you now know exactly, there's no guesswork in that.

Okay, this is what the problems are. And, okay, so I might have high mercury. It doesn't, It wasn't like, Okay let's go find out how you got all this mercury in you.

Is how, is like how are we going to get it out of you? We don't care how you got it. So it's not embarrassing like most men think it is because we're men, right?

And getting over it was freedom to know that there is a way to feel better. The other thing I had in my mind is cost. Like what is it going to cost me?

So getting at my age when I'm like, okay, retirements in the next 10 years, what does medical insurance cost? What does that cost to my family per year?

And I like self-insuring myself. I am self insuring to have a better life by going to deeper healing. And, I was amazed. Oh, this is going burn the bank account up.

This is nothing. If you charge 10 times as much, I'd have still done it because of what I know the result is, right? The cost is not, the feeling better is the part.

You know, people always say, like, what's a day worth? What's the month worth, What is a year worth. Like, for Marty and I, we lost 10 years. What number could I put on that?

There's no number. Like, what are we talking about? $3,000, $4, 000? Yeah. And your entire next 25 years of your life are different? Right. That's like nothing.

Yeah, I know Marty's story. You know him. Your husband's stories and he tells me and I still didn't do anything about it. Right? Because you had to break yourself.

Isn't that crazy how that has to happen? I had get between my own ears. Right. I figured out for myself and I'm like, if I'd have just done what Marty was telling me, like I didn't believe it, I let him lie to me.

And I paid the price for it. You know, sadly, Dr. Bailey says, you know we're the clinic of last resort and unfortunately people have to, You have struggle through.

You struggle to get there. And you also have be, it's a rare person. Most people to be failed by conventional first. Now there are the rare persons who just like they run straight into deeper healing.

I wasn't one of them. I did the conventional thing. I did exactly what you did when we were going through it. i was a regular person, you know, then i did functional and then I was like, this isn't working either.

Right. And it wasn t until, the medallies of deeper healing that we saw recovery. The one thing I will say that excites me about what he said too is by the time he gets a deeper heeling and they're like okay, here's what's going on with you and this is how we're going to reverse it you're compliant.

You're like, game on, let's go. Right. It's not some place you go tip the water with your big toe and say, oh, we might take a little swim. No, you going in and you attack it.

And you take it and then you recover and it happens pretty quickly. Yeah. So let us talk about, first of all, Chip looks and is doing amazing. I feel an awful lot better.

I hate needles. I mean, I'll give you a shot, but you're not going to give me a shock. And just going like the, you will need some IVs. So I'm like, this is not gonna go well.

But I had to get over that. That first day I walked in there, was dripping wet in fear of the unknown and my first collation treatment. Thank you Jesus that I have Sam.

Because Sam, is a delight. I didn't even know the needle was in. And he's like, okay, we're going to walk me through what was getting ready to happen.

My first chelation didn' hit me. I did it on a Thursday morning. Friday I went to work, I was feeling okay. Saturday morning I felt like a bomb had gone off.

What is this smell coming out of me? It's coming from my palms and my hands to the bottom of my feet. Every sweat gland is just reeking. Mean is just pouring out of me is coming this liquid this stuff was coming out my eyes my mouth felt funny I'm like I was already tasting metal, but I really tasted metal today Right, and I like something's going on.

I felt That was the only time I really felt bad once I started going to Deeper Healing. But on the other side of that, Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday was picking it back up before the two-week period had ended and I'm going back in to get my second collation.

And I was like, God, I feel better. So you're feeling like encouraged. It was worth it. Like you used a bathroom in your urine, smells of something metallic, like something's coming out.

Something's happening, right? So, you had very high mercury. We had high, high Mercury, and just for our listeners who don't really understand what chelation is, It is, you know, that's how we pull heavy metals out of the body.

So you get an IV and it's usually DMSA or EDTA, depending on what metals that you have. And it actually, chelate means to bind, so we're going to come in and bind to the heavy metal.

They get stuck in the tissues. I feel like a lot of people don't really understand their doctors. I mean, did you have any doctors before you came to deeper healing talk to you about heavy metals and what they can do to your body?

So, you know, people listening out there, I know these are conversations you're not having with your doctors and heavy medals can be a thing and it sounds like it really was for you and those are common signs.

So when you detox, The first couple days, it can hit you and you can feel bad, but then it's usually up and up after that. Once you start pulling them out, the body's like, whoa.

Right. It was a learning experience because you don't know really what you're up against. Okay, I saw a couple pieces of paper that said, here's the problems.

Okay, let's go attack them. Um, it was a lot to have to deal with. It was all, you know, just let go do this, this and this colonics. I would, I was, that was another fear.

You got colonic? I did. Oh, nice. Session of those. That was something, do you, in reading about this stuff, You're like, wow, people have parasites. They got an eight foot worm that just came out of them I'm like excited to go see what I have.

I'm like, let's go do it. Let's see what's in there. And then you're getting ready to deprive me of oxygen. at like emulating a 8,000 foot or whatever it was kind of environment, altitude, and you're going to cut off all the oxygen and keep me on a treadmill, expect me to move.

And then you've got to put me in a hot box for 30 minutes after you give me something to make me sweat even more. Like, come on. Then take a cold shower after that.

Wow, sounds inviting. You know, I have a day at the spa. and rejuvenates. Don't leave out that little jiggle plate that you stand on for, what, 15 minutes or so?

I mean, little things that are going to, like, why am I sitting on a vibrating plate for 15-minutes after I've just been deprived of oxygen? Which I know Dr.

B would make me say, micro-impact, not a jiggling plate. It's a Jiggle Plate. I remember I walked in a couple times while you were cleansing. You got really into the cleanse.

I did. And you could see the result. That's when stuff was really starting to move for you. My brain is coming back online. This is exciting. Like I'm remembering things that I haven't remembered in years.

Like, I didn't even, like, if you'd come to me and asked me something about my past, maybe I did it, and maybe, but things started coming back around.

The folio cards were now in the brain, were coming to the forefront. And I'm like wow, that's, it was like you know, wow. I can remember things. Things you just, over time, you start forgetting about and those neurons don't seem to trigger the same way.

It was something like you want more of it. Yes. Because you can see it, you feel it and after we got started, like after the cleanses started and I'd gone through the colonics, so getting my gut in helped.

So I can now pass stuff through to my colon to be Properly introduced to what it should be I I think a lot of that had somewhere around in that in this choking episodes everything I had I mean I food to go halfway down and get stuck I either have to get it back out or just sit there and try to just let it do its own thing And I don't know what the enzymes are the that I'm taking Probably pancreatic enzymes.

Yeah, it's the ECI stuff. I don't know what it is that I'm taking, but those things are like heaven because I could look at a pepperoni pizza and have heartburn.

Oh, so you also had heart burn and you were choking. And so it was like, well, if I eat, I'm going to have heartburn. If I don't, and you know, you read these things, lay on your left-hand side, it'll help you get that little enzymatic pill that I take it for every meal.

I've gotten my son started on it because he was having digestive issues and it's just getting your body in sync. A to Z, I went in right to the Z part.

I never got through the front of the alphabet. So now lining it all back up. Every time I ingest food, it gets through what I don't need. It gets out.

You're not choking anymore? all the inflammation's gone down. The inflammation is gone. Like I can move my fingers and not feel problems. My joints don't hurt.

I want to get out of bed. People get outta bed and want go drink coffee or whatever they're habitually addicted to. But I get and wanna take complete foundation.

Oh, I love that. So I take my complete foundations. And that's a multivitamin that we have at the office. We're gonna talk about that too. So, can I say one thing?

Yeah, yeah, because I think it's real important what you just mentioned, and it is the order. And because, I feel like, we see this a lot with patients that come in, like you said earlier, you're like let's just skim in the surface.

It's like if you are out here, kind of have an idea, taking a vitamin C, or you know, drinking an electrolyte drink, oh I know I need a liver support or a detox, whatever that means to them.

But when you do get to deeper healing, I think it's really important for people to realize it is the order of how things happen. Because I feel like most people when they're self-diagnosing themselves and just trying all these different things online, they are missing a big piece of it.

And what you said, could the reason be Because you were choking while you're eating, okay, could you have had reflux? Are you deficient in hydrochloric acid?

Do you need pancreatic enzymes? Is it because you had inflammation? And are you sensitive to foods? Like those kind of things. It was D all above. Exactly.

So like having that really big deep dive to really explore all those things because you're not going to find a doctor out there that's going look at all of those.

And you have to get that part right. That's right and we have start with what are you eating? What's coming in your mouth? Are you digesting? are breaking down the gut part that you mentioned?

And then when it comes to identifying okay what else is in there messing up the system with like the heavy metals or mold or there's usually something there.

There is some sort of infection I always say everyone's an onion to one peel. And it's so rare that someone's just like, I just have… It's not just one thing.

It never is. There's a whole bunch of things going on. But then with the rejuvenase, my point was with this, because it is like the order of what you do and how you get the body well.

Like, it's really not rocket science. And I think, like you mentioned rejuvenase, and I know you and Danielle have known each other for a while, people are out there like, what is re-juvinase?

So rejubinase at deeper healing is Dr. Bowerschmidt's proprietary detox protocol. It is absolutely phenomenal. I'm just going to put a little plug because I am building out his physician training program, I've been having to research it for the past eight weeks.

It is the fastest way to get people well on a mitochondrial level and with inflammation, like what he has designed with everything that you do in the right order.

That's the secret sauce. is and then, you know, it's bringing more oxygen to the cells. Right. And then you're taking the IVs to now flood and pick up the heavy metals and you are taking other things to replace the deficiencies and your sweating out.

We're actually getting stuff out of the body. And clearing it and you're oxygenating it all comes down to blood flow and oxygen. It's highly researched all this stuff like helping Dr.

B in the past couple months and I just think you know you are here giving your testimony and then I want to let people know on the back end of what we are doing here like this is stuff is highly research.

It is a very, very fast way to do it. So looking at what Dr. B and I are doing, because we're looking the research and we are trying to train doctors now on how to this, we can literally change the cells in about three to four weeks.

like getting, changing the mitochondria, flooding the nutrients, correcting nutritional deficiencies, and getting inflammation under control. That's what we're starting to see.

You know, six, four, or six weeks, like, it depends how often you're doing it. But I'm curious, how long would you say was the start to where you were like oh my gosh, I am out?

Because I feel like what you see… Three or four weeks. Oh, yours was three or weeks? Three to four week. I cannot believe the difference. That's amazing.

And I'm trying to pick up on, what am I doing? Like I want more of whatever's getting here quicker, right? Do I need to increase this? You get addicted to it.

The enzymes that I am taking to eat better, to digest food better. That I take to help clean my liver, pregnant alone. What else do I have in there? Now it's a regimen that just go through.

I don't miss it. Yeah well and yours was very personalized and individualized to you. Just for me. So that's where people I feel like sometimes you know you get on social media and they like hear stuff and like I'm just going to run out and buy everything like that is going Irish sea moss.

Oh, yeah, that's great. But I mean, how much of it do you eat it? When do we do, you know, like all this stuff? I people are getting the recommendations from the book to help together.

Dr. B's put the Book of Health together, a simple, simple way to follow it. It's not painful to go through is simple things that you can find anywhere.

We just don't know what the secret sauce is. Yeah, the line of the A to Z up. And so having somebody point me in that direction at what I consider a value for anybody's health to go through it to feel better that quick and then the underlying things like things that didn't show up on my test.

So we were just discussing a little early out in the lobby like the pollen in South Carolina is out of the countries and the blooming stuff is unreal.

It's always affected me. And we're going through it right now. We're just about to the tail end of it. And I've had no problematic and no runny nose, no itchy eyes, nothing, No headaches, Nothing from it, I'm like, well, that had to do with deeper healing because now I feel like if anything doesn't have a reverse effect on how I Feel is cause of deeper.

Yeah. Well, and it's because your inflammation is under control. Your liver, like you don't, you're not filled with heavy metals and other toxins and like your liver especially with allergies when the liver is like the filter, of the body and when it is clogged and its really struggling.

Like yours is with having hypertension and things like that. When you are not breaking down food, when you have kind of this leaky gut, a lot of inflammation, your not absorbing food and nutrients right.

when that liver clogs up, your allergies are going to be so much worse. Your body can't detoxify and it throws the whole immune system off. So it's so all interconnected.

But that's amazing. This is the first pollen that you've gone through since and you're like, I don't even have it anymore. You go out and see your car covered yellow, you see the haze in the air and you're like, yeah, whatever y'all need to do, let's test this some more.

See how long I can go through this. It's cool. You got out of the pollen without even doing LDA. A lot of people use LGA to get out it. And explain what that is.

Yours just, just by reducing your inflammation and becoming your healthier self again. I mean, the side effects of all that health, though, that's the joy of it, is the things you didn't even realize were issues.

Like, I don't say I really had sweet cravings, but I didn' have a desire to eat right, like, eat good. My body was screaming at certain times of the day, hey, you need to, and I wasn't And then I'd eat and feel bad after even feel even worse before I started eating.

And so now that we've cleaned my gut and got my liver like it should and everything's firing on all cylinders, I crave good stuff and I don't eat as much.

I want to I eat the right things. Enjoy things differently. Like I Don't have any sugar craving like sweet tea. We're in the South. Come on. Everybody wants sweet.

I'm now drinking, and that's hard for me as a male southerner, born here in South Carolina, you know, grazed on sweet tea, they put it in our bottles as child.

I am drinking jasmine tea. Now, green jazmine tea with no sugar in it. Right? And in loving life. And that satisfies me now. Whereas you'd have taken me before I went to deeper healing, I had to have that sweet.

You know, it's so funny, you are literally describing the upward spiral, because everybody talks about the downward spiral. We all know what that is. But I've seen it so many times.

The upward Spiral is amazing. And that when you first make the turn, when when You said like, Oh my God, this is working. So then you're like I'm, I mean, and I am going to do this whole thing.

Now all of a sudden it is like the whole And now, now you at the point where you letting go of things that were. It's that mental part, that trip, you have to go over it.

If somebody said, hey, let's just charge you for the first collation and then you'll pay for next 11 that you need, the next 10 and plus the mineralization build up stuff.

And after that first one, I'm like, man, i'm not going back, but I already paid for all this stuff, so I am going. That's the mental trip I had to get over.

I knew I wanted to be better, but it was, after that first one, I was like, you know, if you smell it coming out of you, know it's working. So just let's continue the path.

And the results are, i'm not done yet. I know like my mysotoxin test just came back. i've got another test coming back this week that I should get back, should be back in for another update.

and I'm, not even worried. Whatever it is, it, is if I got to do more of it. Let's just get it done. Yeah. Because my journey is not over yet. When you're out of pain and your mind is back and you can actually eat food and go to sleep.

Right. Who cares? I don't want to be a hundred percent. I want be one thousand percent, right? Yes. Yes, yes. You know, I wanna nail everything. And I know we can't clean our body back to perfection like we were when we maybe a child.

But, you know. We were born with some mercury in us. Where we don' know what we're born like. we didn't have that baseline, but we created it in that first blood panel.

Now I now where I'm at. Let's go get it done. Yeah. Everybody deserves it. I think that all the time when people come in with their little dumb labs from their, you know, TV and I'm like, I had them myself back in the day.

And I was like this is pathetic. This is actually pathetic and then they'll say to them, You're looking good. Yeah, well I have my EKG, so I am great.

Everything is in normal range. I'm really not. I mean, I hear that story all the time. Right. All the times. So I think that's just, you know, your elevating a really important story.

You don't have to wait till you're broken. You could just be proactive. Years ago, when Marty told me his story, and I didn't feel like this, I've been feeling bad for some time, but it just got to the point that I'd given up.

I mean, like you said, Dr. B, the last resort place. If I had known about that to level of what Deeper Healing was doing, The day the door opened up, I'd have been the first one in line.

I want to be patient number one. Wow. Let's go do it. Well, may this inspire other people to think that, you know, they're worthy and deserving of knowing what the heck's going on with them and that they can age beautifully with their mind intact, work at their highest performance.

Right. That's the thing. We don't even realize when we're not well, So much of our days are just lost. Memory. Like just like what did I do two hours ago?

What did we do last week? Or, you know, being able to rest, just get proper sleep and feel good about yourself when you wake up the next morning and to know that your desires have changed.

you know what I want to do in life, what i want my retirement years to look like, how I wanna spend what, I consider the golden years. We work so long to enjoy so little.

So why not make the most of it? And that's the one thing that my wife and I, when Cheyenne goes, she didn't even ask how much it costs. I'm like, I am going to tell you what this is going cost me to feel better to this point.

And when I told her, people spend more than that in five, six months of health insurance. What did they get for it? You got lied to. We're not here to bash big pharma, but those are let's put a mask on it.

Let's go put you in a costume and let send you on your way. And you know, if you're feeling better, then we'll just keep doing what we're doing. If you don't, let us just give you a little more.

You know it's almost like a drug dealer, right? Let us give a more, just make you feel better and keep you going down the road. Whereas when everybody at Deeper Healing, how are you feeling?

You notice that they don' You know, you've got a test, a result, and you can see it. You're going through the steps to feel better. It's hard to explain because it's a different feeling.

Well, the other thing I saw was you were having a little too much fun in that cellular cleansing area. There was a lot of fun. Every time I knew when Chip was in there, I hear everyone laughing.

Oh, really? You why? Because I'm happy. Because you're happy! Joke out of me today. Yeah, you know and I know that I'm gonna feel better Once I leave yeah, and the next step is come back again And you feel the better the time you felt better than next time and it's now to the point that i want more of it Yeah You know like I don't want the road to come to an end.

Like I Don't think if you quit making complete foundation, like what would I do? We need to come back to Complete Foundation. What would I take? I love your story.

We're going to record this separately too, but I want to get it on the podcast. Complete foundation is a powder that Dr. B formulated because he had thousands of patients come in with suitcases, literal suit cases.

of all the supplements that they're on, that's they've bought. They have no idea why they are taking it, they have not idea if they taking enough or not enough and they look like senior citizens with their box and all these pills are taken.

I mean, guilty, we've all done it. where you're just getting caught in the TikTok supplement shop. Right. There's so much beetroot you can eat. Like literally.

So his thing was, he was going through people's suitcases and he's like, you know, 90% of this is garbage. And even the stuff that isn't garbage, they didn't need it.

You don't eat it? And how do I know that? Because they don' have a deficiency with that, His thing was, we're all kind of low on minerals. He's like, what do we need for optimization?

And if you don't have it clean and you have simple, then you're not gonna do it. So he spent a tremendous amount of time formulating this little 30-day supply.

It's a powder, one scoop a day, it's all you need. Adds it with glutathione. You, and it's $39. It's. Right. And you can see, you, can feel it working on you.

Like you feel better. that like taste, vision, hearing. I mean, I can't even, you know, think all of it came from, it's a big result, but if you craving something like that, that you, know is good.

It's not like you said. You've said I've noticed if I miss you're like, if i miss this, one day since I started being for healing, and I was, like I won't do that again.

Wow, that's amazing. I just was in a hurry in the morning. Something's going on. We had a new puppy and I was late to work and was just trying to get out the door.

And I got about halfway to the work. Wow. I did not take what I needed to take this morning, I missed all my supplements, didn't take my complete foundation, and paid the price for it.

And I'm like, that won't ever happen again. Wow. Yeah, all those vitamins and minerals in there. It's very optimal doses, hence the name. But it also has the right forms, like a lot of the methylated forms.

Like it's pushing your mitochondria. ton of B6 in it, and that's a big one that so many people have no idea that they're deficient in, especially women out there, hormone stuff.

It's meant to, but we were just looking at the label earlier today. I'm like, it is such a good formula. Yeah. And it's great for kids. If you're a family, you can just throw it in the smoothie, throw in You're done for the day.

When you go look at supplements, you're sitting there looking at all, let's say, just pick on vitamin C, which is a very important piece of what, if there's any vitamin we really should be taking on a regular daily basis, that's one of the best things to be taken.

You go down the list, and you say vitamin c, go on Amazon or something, Google vitamin, there are thousands of them out there. What do you normally do?

That one's $30 for a month. That was $60 for month that was 100. Let's buy $100 because if you're paying that much, it's got to be good. you know, and it's not.

So how do people go out and buy supplements and think, oh, wow, that's just, let's pay a little more. Oh, I like the container that it comes in or, Oh they have an ad in whatever I read or look at on TV.

And then you get to complete foundation. Like I had shelves of supplements, like trying to do the right thing, but couldn't get there. and then come home with one little old bottle of complete foundation and it replaced an 18-inch wide cabinet, 42 inches tall, full of supplements.

Exactly. Right? I don't have to go through which one's the best anymore. Same. It's there. One little scoop and a little bit of water, shake it up. I mean, we've traveled since I've started this process and my wife was like, really?

You're going to put all of that in the suitcase? Well, I'm not leaving home without it. You know, I need my glutathione. I mean my buffered see I made my complete foundation I needed my Tudka, you know All this stuff goes with us and she's like wow and I didn't just get one bottle of each I got three one for the car one from the shop one further house and you Know it's everywhere because if I miss I can take it now Yeah, yeah, no, the one other thing you said in the beginning that I that like it really tapped in for me When Marty was ill He was, and he wasn't at the bedridden stage, he was just like, not well.

He is incredibly irritable. And he got stuck in a very negative headspace. That wasn t inherently who he is. And I was kind of like, yeah, I didn't sign up for this guy.

This guy's not fun to be around. And you had said that you were like I, was very irritable. I think that's like really happening in a lot of marriages.

It is. You know, you sometimes you can even recognize it in yourself. You're like, oh, that's not me. But you. Can't help it. Right. Because you're just feeling so rotten and you tear yourself up and then it's that loop of like you know the mental physical thing.

So this this also as you get better. Your marriage gets better. Absolutely. It's easier to work. it's easy to rest. Every aspect of your life is just so changed.

No one talks about that. Nobody talks. The mental capacity of what you can control and handle seems easier. Like work you carry work home mentally and you might not have been done with your day and then you know like that eight thirty nine o'clock at night Period hits and Then you're like, oh I forgot that no, I forget that and I've got this and in 30 minutes later You don't even remember you forgot it and and now so you can process things easier.

I think you no I see My marriage There was a lot of issues that most people don't want to agree that they're the problem. I was the problems. And I might still be a little bit of a problem, but it's, I can see.

All of us in a marriage have problems, right? I mean, we've noticed the difference. And it is not to point the finger and go, oh, wow, can't believe you did this or that.

It's just now made life together more pleasurable. Yes. Right? Because my wife and I, my business is family-owned, so my life and work together. The only time we really don't see each other every day is on our trips to and from work.

Right and living working here in Mount Pleasant and the drive to McClellanville is a peaceful 30-minute ride that we get separated from each other We're at home together.

We like spending time together with each. Other now life's become more enjoyable My kids are like, oh now you haven't really said oh, I've got my dad back.

But just like you said my my daughter she would They wouldn't even talk to me when we sat down to eat and I did not want to go out to eating public. If we did, it would be later, be the first ones there, the last ones, there.

So I didn't have to through an episode of choking in a restaurant because I've run to the restroom to throw up food or didn' make it to th restroom just to get it out so I could breathe.

You know, and he has to do that. Wow, that's scary. I didn't realize it was that bad. It was horrible. And to see my daughter go, wow, we can go out to eat and my dad can, you know we enjoy it.

We have fun. Everybody sits quiet. Don't look at dad because he's about to choke every bite. You Yeah, that's what deeper healing is giving me is freedom freedom to Feel like I can make choices again about my own body and what I put in it I would have I forced me to do this But when you see the results in such a great way not just putting a mask on things Let's just get him down the road for another year and he comes back in for his yearly then we'll just kick him up a notch and He'll go on another.

No, this is attacking the problem fixing it so I don't feel like I'm being lied to. I feel I am forcing myself to go do something I do not want to do.

But I see the results. My skin. The glutathione with my skin, my vision. Your skin looks great. And I've gone to the eye doctor since I started. She's like, I know what you're doing, but keep it up because your eyes are improving.

In your late 50s, your vision shouldn't be improving, it should be getting worse. So she did a deep eye scan on it. She's like, God, your eyes look so healthy.

And I'm like must be the glutathione. You know, it's something. Your body's been reset. That's what I think deeper healing does really, really well. Like you hit the reset button.

Right. Fresh start. It's a fresh start and the thing is it's not going to be in six months, a year, two years. Right, it is almost instant. Yeah, It is going be pretty quick.

Once you dig in, I want to say buy into it, but it isn't a buy in. it once you feel it. Because it all new, you haven't ever done anything like this before.

And you know, like we go to a normal doctor, you're like, ah, I hope he doesn't make me take my clothes off today. You know? It's like that's your worst fear.

you have to take your clothes of at deeper healing too. Get a colonic. But you get a colonic. Yeah. Have to go get in the hot boxes. I call it, get into the sauna, You have take a shower after, but it's, it like wow.

It feels so much better. Like I looked forward to my trips to deeper. Healing. And I look forward seeing the people there and the environment that it created because I know it works.

Yeah, and I know every time I go there I feel so much better mentally and physically once I've left there because I Know I'm that we as a collective group are attacking it.

We know that We can see the results I can feel the result. It's making my life easier to live. Just making mine days happier I see a future again, you know, my kids are happy with me and i wake up out of a sleep and ready to get out a bed and go joy the next day.

Wow. That's so awesome. I mean, this is it. This is why we do what we. Do. It's exactly why do this. Yeah. Because this gonna help so many people. There are so people out there like Chip Lake and you do not need to lose another minute of your life like slogging it like you're doing.

Thank you, Chip, for sharing. I know that your practitioner, Julianne Ingham, is so proud of you. The girls just really enjoyed having you—always do when you're in the center.

It's a fun environment in there, and having fun people like you who are just happily going after it, that's what it's all about. You paid full price, go get all you can get of it.

Go get it, yeah. And you feel so much better on the other side. Just do the steps. Yeah. Follow the, just negate the results. You know, that's all we're doing is trying to push the result to the way.

The nice thing is everything that you did, it's sustainable and long lasting. Right. So this isn't like, you're not going to need to be doing this stuff forever.

I know this is like you are going fly away and live your life. You know, and that's the beauty of it. I mean, a deeper healing should be like a… Everywhere.

Grocery stores. You can't really live without a grocery store anymore, right? So why are we not putting a Deeper Healing type environment on every street corner?

I say that all the time. The guy who's here this week is from London, the other person's from Greece. Why do people have to fly from a London? Right. We've been lied to.

To hit a reset button. And yet they actually do. Good for them that they figured it out. Right? We need deeper healings all over the place. Yeah, we do, yeah.

It needs to be serious care. They're doing a little bit of this stuff. Like I was informed. I mean, I watched the internet, and I see these people talking about, oh, if you do this, you'll be better than that.

But that's just scratching the surface. At least Dr. B has formulated it out. Okay, these are the steps we need to do to get to the maximum result. And you can't find that completion.

I feel like anywhere. Well, and I think why. Okay, good. I love it. So you have a lot of like holistic coaches out there. You have lots of functional medicine doctors out here which highly respect their training.

We have some naturopathic doctors. What makes Dr. B so different is the environmental medicine training that he's received. I actually trained under the same mentor Dr.

Crinion and what we're taught and it's a different way of detoxing than your average holistic health coach and your Average functional medicine doctor or functional health Coach.

It is a way more in depth, I guess is the best way to say it, protocol. I mean, it's like on steroids compared to what they do. So that, just to get across to the listeners, like what we do and how we it and the order that we There's a process to it and it works.

It works beautifully. And it's just what they do. Like they are, you're going to get some results. You're gonna feel a little bit better, but it is not going be the level of like literally like your eyes getting better.

Your memory coming back. Where people are reversing aging and reverses disease. That's what our process does. I mean, it really does. And that's why it's so awesome.

It's been interesting the last year, two years, we've started seeing a lot of functional naturopathic doctors and just regular MDs referring in people that have been languishing on the vine for a long time under their care.

I don't know what to do with this person. They're missing something. You know, they're like missing it and they know they don t know it. Right. And they re referring them in.

So that's new. I think that the word s getting out on the practitioner level, like, okay, this environmental medicine is a piece I d n't understand, and this is what I t ink is missing for you.

That's huge. Yeah. Because I th nk as this grows, as more practitioners learn, Oh, this is how we reverse it. We're going to see it become more mainstream medicine.

You should. I really think that's the future. Because like we've said before, I think we'd been lied to. Or just people don't have the correct knowledge.

That's really what it is. They're following their training. And Dr. B says all the time, we really need to um We weren't trained for the world we're living in right like it is that simple.

Yeah Well from from a user of deeper healing I got more than I bargained for yes, right? Like what I was trying to come in to me and then like we didn't have a pinpoint of what was wrong but I Got more in what i was bargaining for because so i've seen so much improvement in so many other areas that It's hard to really put it into words of what has happened, right?

Like, I don't go every six weeks to get a haircut. I need to one every two weeks. Why is my hair growing so fast? Why am I cutting my fingernails feels like every other day?

You know, because I'm healthy, Right? I am feeling good, growing good. That's a great sign. You just did one to not choke. One not to choke and not feel so suave.

It felt like the Michelin man. I come in all swole up and couldn't bend over and the bonus out of it, like I said, I dropped 20 pounds. I feel better because of that.

And it wasn't like, oh, we just lose it. That's just a bonus. It's like going to the eye doctor and being able to see better. She's, something's wrong with his contacts.

Oh, your eyes have been improved. You went from a negative seven to a minus six. How did that happen? You were here just less than a year ago. She's like, what are you doing different?

And I'm like I am going to a place called Deeper Healing and they're healing the deep, all right, bad parts, you know, and she's, like wow, your eyes look amazing.

And so those are just the bonuses of it because we don't realize everything that potentially going and getting worse in our body and just by simply following these steps, we're just I say it all the time because I do a lot of the calls with the very sick cases and they always talk to me about their biggest pain point.

So if your biggest point at the was like, every time I eat, I choke, that probably would have been one of your top things. And they'll focus on that. I just want that fixed.

Well, we're definitely going to look at that, but tell me some of other things that are going on. And they'll always say, well, nothing really. And I'm like, now I'll start asking questions.

Then before you know it, I have a very long list. That questionnaire to get to that point. They're like oh, forgot to tell you about my eczema or my chronic diarrhea for 10 years.

There's 44 other things that were already happening. I guess just so you now, we're going to look to improve everything. We're not just going after that.

It's called deeper healing. It is the whole system because we know the system is working together. Right. And your whole systems is better. But that's what I'm saying is like the bonus parts of it are amazing because it's just that quality of being a different person every day, being my best self at every moment.

Yeah. And not feeling, oh, wow, here comes two o'clock, the cliff is here again, I am going to fall off of. I feel I just as ready to go at eight o clock at night.

It was as eight O'Clock in the morning. That's amazing. You know, it's like, wow, yeah. You look forward to the weekend so you can kind of just relax a little, not have as much pressure on you.

It's just like bring it on. Let's go do whatever. So in terms of the cost, because I do think cost people are very hesitant to spend out of pocket. Insurance doesn't cover what deeper healing does and we could argue, I think they should for sure.

Absolutely. It's all medical stuff and it's amazing stuff. And it should be covered, but it is not. So that's a hurdle for people to get over. I know from our side, we do everything in our power to keep it as reasonable as possible.

very high quality medical care at the best value that we can give. And for you to say, I got more than I bargained for. I can't even tell you the amount of people that have said that to me when they've gotten on the other side.

They're like, this was worth every penny. And I use the word penny because of how cheap and or inexpensive it is for the results that I've gotten. If I tried to go do this through modern everyday medicine, I would have so many specialists looking at me.

I'd be at the pharmacist Probably every other day it seems like, you know, I would have tons of prescriptions. I'd be taking 40 pills in the morning and I feel like the added value is just how you feel to go knock out the next day.

Cost doesn't matter anymore, right? Because I couldn't buy a year's worth of medical insurance for what I've spent at Deeper Healing. I said that the wrong way.

So the inexpensive part of it has now negated it for the result, right? That's the best way to say it is that you don't realize the cost doesn't matter anymore.

If you said, hey, we're having a 50% increase tomorrow. Okay. You know, it's still worth it. You know, and I don't know how you keep the cost where they are but and that's the thing is that I Don't look at insurance as a supplement for my health.

I look it my help. There's a Supplement to the insurance part. Yeah I have to say that was a mind shift for me. That's that 2016 I left insurance I went to Christian health shares because I was like I am paying a very high premium And I don't even.

use any of it and paying everything out of pocket because this is what he needs. And I just was like, I have to reverse this mentality of trying to use my insurance card for something that's not…

Yeah, because through that mentality, wow, paying this stuff every month and they tell me I need to go see Dr. XYZ. That's where I go and I'm paying all this money, so that where should go.

We're all fooled into it. I know. You're just following the cow in front of you to the slaughterhouse. You did it was it? Was a big awakening and that's when things really changed right things Really changed them and i'm and I'm talking, you know, it's not and.

I don't want to say what my journey has cost me But I can't put a value on it like you did because I know what has caused me up to today To go through what i've gone through with deeper healing if and That's what I've seen is is this it.

It's like this I want say like it the cheapest place to go but wow To get that kind of result, who wouldn't want the added value to know what little bit of money it costs to feel so much better.

It's like, I don't even think about the insurance part. I know. You know, it's negated by the result. Yeah. So that's a perfect way to end. That's perfect.

Chip, thank you so. Thanks for having me. you're amazing. Thank you. And I think I'm going to help a lot of people. Good. I couldn't, I mean, nobody has to ask me.

I tell them, you know, if you've got a problem, that's, where I would go. You know. It's all been organic. The whole thing. Right. Deeper healings growth has all, been from people like you going out there and going, You don't have to be that tired anymore.

Yeah. Well, and it's like a little hidden gem here. Like nobody knows we're here, most of our people come from out of town. And I'm like, people in Charleston, like I, mean we have this podcast getting ready to come out.

We have some other things that were, are in the works. you got in before it got crazy. Yeah, the local people are always really shocked when they come in.

They're like, I didn't even know this was here. This is crazy! Yeah. But then all the people come from out of town. And so we do for the listeners out there have a two week stay and heal if you qualify for that.

So people will come and it's just so amazing. I'm so glad that you Got the results that you did and you're feeling like you are back. Yep, I'm back where I should be and I am still working on it.

That's the awesome part. Thank you so much for being here and if you guys want to learn any more about Deeper Healing, it's deeperhealing.com and i'm sure you'll see some more notes and links below and we will see you next time.

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